EPISODE 430: The Efficient Chiropractor: From Chaos to Control with Jason Infinger
Hey, chiropractors. We're ready for another Modern Chiropractic Marketing Show with Dr. Kevin Christie, where we discuss the latest in marketing strategies, contact marketing, direct response marketing, and business development with some of the leading experts in the industry.
Speaker: [00:00:00] Welcome to another episode of Modern Chiropractic Mastery. Today I'm excited to bring you Jason Infinger. I had come across his work from one of our colleagues when I had posted on a Facebook group, 'cause I've been in this search. To really reduce as much friction as we possibly can for the patient experience.
Speaker: And, and, uh, I was referred to Jason and, and when we got on a phone before the podcast to kind of work through what we wanted to dive into, we realized we really needed to start with the practice and the doctor and the owner of the practice and, and get a lot of that stuff efficient, uh, before we can even really think about having.
Speaker: Kind of a friction free, uh, patient experience. And so we wanted to dive into, into that. Uh, Jason is a, a business advisor and serial entrepreneur who's helped healthcare founders scale from solo chaos to streamline teams. Uh, he specializes in AI into integration, business efficiency, and building companies from, uh, [00:01:00] with long term enterprise value.
Speaker: Uh, he's also the founder. Of parenting autism and a dad of a child on the spectrum. And I wanna go back to the aspect of him, you know, with the AI integration, business efficiency and, and building companies with long-term enterprise value. And that's what we really dive into today. Um, and that business efficiency is the, the core component of our conversation and we dive into that, is a wealth of knowledge.
Speaker: And, and, uh, you know, no matter what stage you're at. In your practice or your future practice, you really need to start considering these things so that you have a practice that is efficient, even if it's just so you don't have so many damn headaches every day, like so many chiropractors do. Uh, but ultimately if you do this type of work, you'll see the benefit of it.
Speaker: You'll be more profitable. Uh, you'll have a business that scales, even if you just wanna scale one practice. Uh, so many of you. I think scaling means [00:02:00] having multiple locations, and that could be, but within a chiropractic practice, so many run up against these barriers to growth, and they have not built a practice that can scale.
Speaker: So we dive into, uh, some of that today. Before we do, I wanted to give a little shout out to a friend and colleague of ours, Alex Wasserman. Uh, he's developed something. He, he used to work with me. And I know his, uh, talents in technology has been pretty impressive. He did a lot of work with us when he was a doctor here.
Speaker: Um, but many of you that are Jane App practice management users and use office allies for the claims clearing house, there's, there's kind of been a disconnect between the two. Uh, well, Alex has developed something called claims app and you can go to claims app app, so that's claims app. Uh, and it's basically, it's an interface, right?
Speaker: So it's a service and browser extension that'll integrate your Jane app. A software and the Office Ally Claims Clearinghouse. So now you can just upload the [00:03:00] claims and download the remittance files between Jane Epp and Office Ally with a single click, um, instead of how you've had to do it now. So check that out@claimzap.app.
Speaker: I don't have any affiliation with it, but I, uh, I've always liked and appreciate his work and he had told me about this and I know a lot of Jane App users with, um, office Ally. Uh, this could really help you out, so check that out. All right. Without further ado, here is my interview with Jason Infinger.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Alright, I got Jason Infinger on the podcast today and excited to dive into a few things. Efficiency is gonna be a big part of it, and I think a lot of chiropractic practice struggle with this. Obviously businesses in general do, uh, and oftentimes we want, we have a vision of what we want to provide for our patients, but if we can't get this part right of what we're gonna talk about today, it's really hard to accomplish that.
Dr. Kevin Christie: So, before we dive into it, Jason, uh. Introduce yourself. Tell us a little bit about yourself and, and what you got going on.
Jason Infinger: Yep, you got it. Well, thanks for having me on. I really appreciate it today, Kevin. [00:04:00] So, um, you know, for me it's been about, I've been a serial entrepreneur since I was 16, so, um, had a few businesses on that side and, um, for me it's led me to the path of, um, really helping in, in the advisory role I.
Jason Infinger: And, um, a lot of people, you know, reaching out after a few businesses and things, um, did well and, you know, answering questions. And I just kind of formalized it over the years as things kind of kept growing, um, which was great and it was really fulfilling for me on that side. And then, you know, my, my passion really is, is healthcare.
Jason Infinger: And, um, one of the things my, my youngest son was diagnosed with autism, so that, that even dove me further into the healthcare. Part of things. And, uh, so I primarily work with, with the healthcare industry as a whole. Um, so the chiros, uh, funk med, that kind of thing too. So really enjoy it and get a lot of fulfillment out of that side.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Yeah. Do you see anything different between the chiropractic and the functional medicine, or is it very similar and the same issues that we're, we're all dealing with from a business standpoint?
Jason Infinger: Yeah, it's, it's [00:05:00] very similar, you know, patient experience, all that kind of good stuff. And, um, I had the fortune of working with a, uh, a physician and, and scaling his practice to 27.
Jason Infinger: So we just formalized the plan and just kind of kept growing. Right. Kept going with it. So
Dr. Kevin Christie: Nice. I'm sure they run into similar issues, uh, that we do. Yes.
Jason Infinger: Yes,
Dr. Kevin Christie: for sure. Um. But yeah, let's start right outta the gates 'cause we're gonna dive into, uh, a handful of things. But, um, what are the, the key signs that you see in a chiropractic practice that's just not running efficiently?
Dr. Kevin Christie: I.
Jason Infinger: Yeah. Um, it's a great question. I think that, um, uh, the fact how much time the actual founder and, uh, practitioner is actually in, in the business in terms in the weeds, so to speak, and, um, working in the business and not on it as much. I think that's always a, a, uh. Interesting telltale sign and also, you know, how you manage your time as a clinician.
Jason Infinger: I think that, um, there's a great book called E Myth that handles this, and a lot of, a lot of physicians that I meet are what's, [00:06:00] they're undergoing what's called entrepreneurial seizure, right? They're just. So overwhelmed with things and they're, you know, they're an amazing clinician, but on the other side, now they've taken on this other hat of, okay, now I gotta run a business and figure out how to, you know, bring patients in and how to service them the right way.
Jason Infinger: All those kind of good things. So for me, I can tell almost by the tone of the voice. From the clinician when I talk to 'em about kind of where they're at in their journey, right? If they're one to three years or, or five to eight, and a lot of times the businesses will, will break certain revenue places 'cause certain clinicians can get to a certain place in revenue and then things start to break down.
Jason Infinger: So what got them to 1 million doesn't get them to two or three and so on.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Yeah. Do you find also sometimes with the mindset, they, they may don't, maybe they don't trust, uh, uh, other people in the, in the practice like hiring and associates or team members, they don't want the, the headaches of it because they're so busy treating patients and they get some of the limiting factors like that.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Do you run into that often?
Jason Infinger: Yeah, quite a bit. I think there is a, [00:07:00] there's a great difference between having a growth mindset, both as a clinician and as a business owner, right? Versus a, a fixed, right? Mm-hmm. Because you feel like, you know, kind of how things go, but once you get past 1 million in revenue and so on, there are certain things that.
Jason Infinger: That you have to get really good at. And one of 'em is, is talent acquisition, right? Yeah. You have to get good at spotting great people and surrounding yourself with amazing people. And I know that's, it sounds easy, but it's a really hard thing to do personally, and it's a hard thing to do in your, in your business, is to surround yourself with amazing people.
Jason Infinger: On that side.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Yeah. And I, I was having a conversation with a colleague of mine who, who doesn't treat patients now, he owns, uh, four or five locations, and he was just saying how, uh, I think it was three or four years ago, he stopped treating patients. He's like, I don't know how chiropractors do it. Uh, we treat patients and, and also try to run the business.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Obviously he's trying. He's got some big goals in multiple locations and, you know, it just got me thinking 'cause we're in that unique situation where, you know, as an entrepreneur, um, we also are a professional and we, we have to do , our talented thing that we have. It's [00:08:00] not like. We just own a set of, you know, Wendy's restaurants and can just, uh, you know, be an entrepreneur like that.
Dr. Kevin Christie: We actually have to cook the hamburgers and the french fries and, and do all that. And it, it can, it can be tricky. Uh, what are, what are a couple things that you recommend for the doc that, uh, you know, still has to treat patients? So, let's talk with that person right now, they still have to treat patients, but they've made the decision they want to actually grow this business.
Dr. Kevin Christie: They want to work on the business. What are a few things that you, you tell them? Yeah. To try to have some boundaries around that.
Jason Infinger: Absolutely. Um, I think there, there are three things that I want to kind of cover real quick because I think it, yeah, it really deals with the beginning and the middle and the end of kind of where we're going today.
Jason Infinger: Mm-hmm. And one is, is self-awareness, right? Yeah. I think you have to be really clear on, I. On who you are and having, having a clear vision. And when I say vision, meaning that a forecast, like where is the industry going, right? Like AI is a big topic right now. Where, where are things going on that side? So having a clear vision, right?
Jason Infinger: Uh, your North Star, having a [00:09:00] mission, which is what you do every day. Right. Having a unique value prop, like why you're different, right? Than other clinicians. What that start to look like. Um, and then that goes into your persona. So once you build a foundation around things, you kind of know where you're going.
Jason Infinger: So for me, we're always talking about self-awareness and then self-criticism. You know, knowing you. Knowing what, knowing what the change and improve. And then self-determination, which is, you know, having the systems and things to actually act on those things. But that, does that help in terms of context?
Jason Infinger: Yeah.
Dr. Kevin Christie: It does. Okay. Because I think that's a big part of it is that it's easy to just say, oh, you know, do this. But you obviously wanna get clear on, on that. And, uh, I think you, you mentioned growth mindset and obviously great book about that. Um, yep. I don't think chiropractors give themselves enough credit on what they can learn.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Right. And I always try to tell 'em, it's like, look. Mm-hmm. When you, when you left undergrad college and you went into chiropractic school, could you have ever, like if, if when you were 22 years old, could you have ever imagined. Being 32 and owning a good practice, right? Like you couldn't make that [00:10:00] leap.
Dr. Kevin Christie: You, you hoped and dreamed about it, and maybe you had a vision of that, but you had no idea how to do it. But you had, you were receptive, you were a blank canvas, and you, uh, you, you really learned over those course of years to, to do it and use that as a, uh, uh, evidence that you. Took on something really challenging and hard before, and that you could take on something hard and challenging again.
Dr. Kevin Christie: And it may look differently now, like maybe you are just in the weeds as a clinician, but you want to take that next step and get out of the weeds and build a, a very thriving business that is ultimately, uh, sellable. And I think that's something that chiropractors have to realize is that they, they, they can do this.
Dr. Kevin Christie: They may need guidance, they may need help doing it, but they can do it.
Jason Infinger: Yeah. Yeah, I, I agree. The foundational piece and, um, if you don't mind, I'll make a book recommend. Yeah. So I think as a clinician, you reach a certain place and you should start spending your time on how you buy back your time. Mm-hmm.
Jason Infinger: And so there's a great book. Um, so, so, um, uh, by Dan [00:11:00] Martel, who mm-hmm. Is, is amazing about whatever stage you're at as a clinician on how you start buying back your time. Right. Yeah. Because you, to be a leader in the industry, you have to get out of the weeds, right? And for some clinicians, I have this conversation a lot in terms of like, like, what's your perfect week?
Jason Infinger: What does that even look like for you? Like how much time do you wanna spend with patients? How much on the business? Like what are your, your impact measurements, right? You got into this for a reason, to make an impact in people's lives, and people reach a certain threshold and they go, okay, is this as good as it gets?
Jason Infinger: Right? I'm wearing all these hats, I'm doing all these things. This is not what I thought it was gonna be. So that's when you have to start looking at how you buy back your time.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Yeah, that makes sense. And it's almost like having a little bit of delayed gratification too, where Yeah, you know, if you end up with X amount more profit per quarter because you're doing some things right and you know, you could go buy the new car, but, but maybe you actually use that money and reinvest it into buying your time.
Dr. Kevin Christie: And again, that could probably be, um, with investment in automations or software or in or in or in [00:12:00] people to then be able to take that next step. Is that something that you kind of work through with people, is like the financials of this vision as well?
Jason Infinger: Yeah, you have to have a, you know, there are, and a lot of founders don't like to talk about numbers, right?
Jason Infinger: Mm-hmm. But you know, most, most founders operate from lagging numbers. They look at what they did in the past, but they have no foresight in the forecast in terms of like where they're going, right? Mm-hmm. And having a clear vision on that first side is one thing, but then attaching numbers to what that looks like.
Jason Infinger: For example, how many patients do I need this year to hit X? Right? What does that start to look like? And it's just a funny thing when you start paying attention to it. It naturally starts to happen, right? Yeah. When you don't have that, you're just in this whole, you know, process and it kind of, you know, you re replay the same day over and over and over again, right?
Jason Infinger: You keep doing the same thing, right? And expect a different result.
Dr. Kevin Christie: You do. And you know, I'm kind of in a, a little bit of a transition in our practice where we, we've got a good big space. We've got a big open rehab area, and for the last seven years we've, we've rented it out to a physical therapy group and it's been good pay a good [00:13:00] rent really helps.
Dr. Kevin Christie: I own the space so it, it helps with the mortgage and all that. And it's been nice and great symbiotic relationship. But they're, um, they've outgrown the space and then at the end of the year, they're gonna, uh, move into their own, which is, which is awesome, you know, for them. And we're, we're gonna just.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Take over the space ourselves. And I, I kind of started to realize, you know what I, that probably was a growth block, a capacity block, having mm-hmm. A space being shared. And now it opens us up to a lot of, uh, opportunities, uh, that I wasn't thinking about, uh, last year. So I'm excited about that. There's always a little bit of, uh, you know, you're uncomfortable when you maybe lose rent money or whatever, or you're trying to take the next step.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Um. And so I think you gotta, but you gotta be comfortable with that, right? It's, it's, it's not gonna be easy, but it's an opportunity.
Jason Infinger: Yeah. And it's an adventure, right? I mean, I think that mm-hmm. The, you know, vocabulary is a powerful thing, right? And it really is. So, um, I have a, I have a founder a few years ago, and, um, [00:14:00] um, and she's amazing clinician, but she kept, when we were having these conversations, she kept using the word overwhelm all the time.
Jason Infinger: I'm overwhelmed. I'm overwhelmed. I'm, I'm like, look, let's just play an exercise, right for the next week. Let's not use that word. Right. Let's use adventure. Let's use something else that you choose, right? Because it's a weird thing when you, when you stop replaying that same word in your head, which has negative connotation, it, it changes things, right?
Jason Infinger: It changes your perspective. It puts you into more of a growth mindset. 'cause it is an adventure, right? Yeah. You're helping people and doing all these amazing things, but at the same time you, you're running a business, right? So you have to figure out, so it's learning on the fly.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Yeah, and that's something I've, I've noticed as well, and it's concerning, uh, a lot of chiropractors, um, keep on thinking about burnout and overwhelm, and they talk about it so much and it's almost like a, it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy versus the ones that don't do that and just think of it as, you know, hard work worth doing and I have to do it, and, you know, maybe I'm.
Dr. Kevin Christie: 30 years old, and I'm in a [00:15:00] stage of life where, yeah, you gotta work really hard, but when you're 45 or 50 or 55, like you, things will look a little bit different, but you're gonna, you're gonna reap that reward. But, uh, yeah, I think too many people are latching onto that and they have to get clear on the vision and work towards that and, and realize, uh, uh, it's, it's worth doing that hard work.
Dr. Kevin Christie: But, um, I kind of mentioned my, my potential capacity block that I've had over some time with, with the PT renting. Um. What do you, you know, you talk a little bit about the difference between growth mode versus capacity mode. Um, yeah. What, what are, what does, what does that exactly mean? Yeah. And what are your thoughts on as, as it pertains to practice?
Jason Infinger: Yeah, as a business, there are kind of two areas here that you kind of work back and forth. It's kind of like a teeter-totter, right? So if you're in growth mode and trying to find more patients and grow your practice and do those kind of things, there are certain things that your business has to adjust to, right?
Jason Infinger: You have to understand marketing, you have to understand patient onboarding, successful onboarding, those kinda things. When you're in growth mode, right? Mm-hmm. When [00:16:00] you're in capacity, and I ask this question a lot of founders, is that like, where is your capacity now? Are you, are you there? Right. Yeah, because there's all these measurements and different things we can talk about, but something else that's important too is I think that everybody needs to have a dashboard, right?
Jason Infinger: Mm-hmm. There needs to be a dashboard in place because you don't know when you put systems in place, but no way to kind of check them to know what's working and what isn't. It's a very disheartening thing, especially when you're spending a lot of money on it. Yeah. So you're constantly balancing this whole growth and capacity thing, right?
Jason Infinger: Mm-hmm. You want to be in growth, but understand how to get more patients and those kind of things. But then on the backside, once you do that, then the capacity shifts. So part of this is about anticipation and building a plan and a strategy on how to grow.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Yeah. So you, some practices are in that situation where they don't have any blocks to grow.
Dr. Kevin Christie: They just gotta grow and they gotta do the right things to do that. And then you run into some, it sounds like, that are, um, you know, they'll, they'll come to you with an excuse like, well, I can't really see more new patients. I don't have the time on my schedule. Or, you know, I, [00:17:00] I, I really can't find good talent, or I don't have the space.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Are those some of the things you're thinking about as far as like when they're, they're, they're hitting that roadblock?
Jason Infinger: Yeah. All the time. Right. I think that, um, that, that's a, that's a common thing, and it is, it is a roadblock, but the issue is, it goes back to the vision again. Right. And I don't think people slow down on mission statements and things for businesses, but not really slowing down on a North Star about where you're going.
Jason Infinger: Right? And, and for some clinicians, it's not about getting big. Right. It's about impact. So you know, going from a one-to-one model to a one to mini model can be a better way to do it. Maybe you wanna be an influencer in things. Right. Especially with social media, because, you know, my belief is there are two things that are gonna shift the landscape of healthcare dramatically, right?
Jason Infinger: AI obviously is gonna be a big one, but the other one is content marketing. Yep. Right. We have to get good at that. And I don't mean it being serviceable, like you're just kind of posting things up. 'cause you know you have to post two or three things, but being intentional around it, right. And truly kind of helping people on that side, [00:18:00] I.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Yeah, especially it seems like as a, people are using AI search more, and we're going hop into the AI conversation here in a minute, but it seems like Gary V was at the Parker Vegas seminar talking about where, uh, AI search is obviously gonna be a big thing if it already is, but those who are doing consistent educational content on a lot of platforms, that's where AI's gonna probably pull that information and find you as the, the local chiropractor.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Is that what you're, you're seeing.
Jason Infinger: Yeah. And I, I think clinicians, they do what they know, right? So they understand the servicing piece, they understand the process, the plan of care, all that kind of good stuff. And they tend to want to kind of keep in that space. They have this, this area they wanna live in.
Jason Infinger: And part of my job too is to kind of, uh, push the status quo around the learning and going back to the growth mode piece, right? Yeah. If we need to learn how, how to integrate AI and the first stage of all of it's gonna just be understanding and what, what the integration is going to be. Looking like not taking over jobs, right?
Jason Infinger: It's gonna be more of the integration [00:19:00] if you can get things in your practice to move faster by integrating certain things, right?
Dr. Kevin Christie: Yeah, I'm excited about it. 'cause obviously AI is not gonna take our hands away from us as a chiropractor in, in most of our futures, maybe down the road 20, 30, 40 years from now.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Maybe. I doubt it, but um, yeah, I think we can leverage it to do a lot of things. But I want to, I wanna go back to one thing. Yeah. And then we can jump to the ai you mentioned dashboard. Yeah. What are some of the metrics that a chiropractor should track to know, you know, if their practice is growing efficiently?
Jason Infinger: Yeah. Uh, you know, it's gonna sound, I love simple things, right? So, you know, tracking leads and more importantly, like where they're coming from, right? Mm-hmm. Yeah, and I think an important question that is always, it, it is very important. It's probably the most important, right? When somebody's being onboarded or, or somebody is contacting your practice.
Jason Infinger: Where did you first find us? Where did you first find us? Not where did you find us? It's an important distinction because you don't know as a clinician, like where to put your money if you're trying to get more patients. Right. Is it a referral? Who, okay, well it's a referral. [00:20:00] Did it come from another physician?
Jason Infinger: If it is it's best practice to kind of reach out to that physician and say, really? I, I appreciate that. Right. So there are, there are best practices around it. So the dashboard part of things, leads is a big one. Like where they're coming from. And are they coming inconsistent? Because, you know, there there are two, there are two flywheels in a business.
Jason Infinger: One is the lead acquisition, and then one is on the other side, which is talent acquisition. Those wheels don't have to be moving at the same pace, but they have to be moving. And traditionally, for a lot of clinicians, neither one of 'em are moving or they're not paying attention to either one, right? Yeah.
Jason Infinger: They're just focusing on their, their plan of care and their service.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Yeah. And a lot of times if they do get the flywheel going on the marketing and, and leads and, but they don't have the team to, to really service that, that's when they hit that capacity and they say, oh, I, yep. And then they can't see a new patient for two weeks.
Dr. Kevin Christie: And some of 'em wear that like a badge of honor. It's like, oh no, that's. Not, not ideal. Yeah. Not good.
Jason Infinger: Yeah. No, it is not good. And, and, and dropping the ball once, once a, a, a patient contacts the [00:21:00] practice, right? Mm-hmm. How long it's taken to follow up, all those kind of things. If, if your vision is, you're this amazing clinician and you want to create, you know, impact and you're solving all, you know, root cause and problems and different things, but yet you can't follow up right, right away, it, it ruins your reputation as a clinician, even if you're really, really good.
Dr. Kevin Christie: No, it, it does. And I think that's something that we gotta get really, really clear on and, and have that, um, efficiency in it. And, you know, AI is gonna be a, a big part of that. And you and I are both fans of Abundance 360 and Peter Diamandis. Yeah. And, uh, he mentions that Human Plus ai, uh, is where the sweet spot is.
Dr. Kevin Christie: What are some of your thoughts on that combination of the, of the human and the ai and how that pertains to a chiropractic practice?
Jason Infinger: Yeah. And let me go back just real quick to, yeah. What we talked about, just the follow up process. I think there, um, there was a great report that came out recently in the industry is that the average time it takes a clinician to follow up with somebody that contacts the [00:22:00] practice.
Jason Infinger: Mm-hmm. Do you know how long it is? No. I'm scared to know it's four days. Oh God. What is the expectation of the patient calling? What's the expectation of that? They have with the follow up, immediate, immediate. Within 20 minutes. Yeah. Right. Yeah. So there's this huge disconnect of how that actually works.
Jason Infinger: So that leads into your other question, which is how can AI help solve those things? Yeah. Those are the kind of bottlenecks for a business that can really be helpful because immediate. Interaction on with areas specific that maybe you don't enjoy doing. Mm-hmm. But you can't do anything without the business development piece.
Jason Infinger: Right. So you have to get really good. And if there's one, I'm big about this question, is that what's the one thing that could solve all problems with your practice? Yeah. Um, what's the one thing if you do and get it really right? It solves all problems, patient experience. It's, it's actually that, well, the experience is the second part, but the first part is you have to get them to come in.
Jason Infinger: Right? You [00:23:00] have to, oh yeah. Yes. You have to get the leads on the other side. And it sounds so simple, but it's very, very hard for a lot of clinicians. They can get leads, like they'll pay attention to it for a month or two, and they go back, right? To work with patients, and then it's this back and forth thing to where their leads aren't consistent.
Jason Infinger: Right.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Yeah. And that's the thing is, um, I've, I've mentioned it often where we sometimes as doctors fail to realize how big of a deal it is for a patient to schedule an appointment and go see a doctor. There's a lot of uncertainty around it. Fear they're, you know, 'cause they've been burned in the medical model maybe, and they.
Dr. Kevin Christie: And, and they're just, it's not a pleasant experience in most situations. So what can we do for the whole entire experience to make it a pleasant experience? But obviously you gotta get 'em in the door first. And, and I think that's a, mm-hmm. A big thing that we, um, need to emphasize. There's some, some things that you've, uh, you've seen work really well in that regard is like actually getting them in the door efficiently.
Jason Infinger: Yeah. I mean, I think that [00:24:00] going back to, to partnerships is a big one, right? Mm-hmm. Things that don't cost the practice a lot of revenue and money, but building relationships both on the, on talent acquisition and building, building relationships there and surrounding yourself with good people. The same thing on the partnership side.
Jason Infinger: There are people that that can be great referral partners for you. And establishing referral partner network is really important and having touch time and, and scheduling that I'm a big fan of, of time blocking, for example, like there should be time set aside for a clinician, especially if it's the first part of your day if you're doing something like that.
Jason Infinger: That your, your outreach and those kind of things are the first hour of every day, right? Mm-hmm. You spend an hour just doing outreach in your day, then you can start your day in terms of, you know, planet cares and that kind of thing. But the, that, that would be the, the most important thing is that, is doing it consistently.
Jason Infinger: Yeah. So partnerships. Um, the other piece is email marketing can be effective too, as well. Mm-hmm. Depending on the application. Um, but those are two of the places that you'd probably start to be efficient, but you have to be [00:25:00] consistent.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Yeah, it's almost like two parts. There's the part of like getting the lead and, and obviously them raising their hand and wanting to come in and calling and scheduling.
Dr. Kevin Christie: And then the second part of that is them, okay, they've scheduled the appointment, them actually showing up to it, uh, is, is the second. Mm-hmm. Part of that. And so we've. Yeah, we've actually recently, I would say this year we've tackled that second part of mm-hmm that what I just mentioned. And we've done certain things like, um, we shot a professionally done welcome video to where it can introduce the doctors, show the office, some of the nuances of getting to our practice.
Dr. Kevin Christie: 'cause we're in a weird, uh, our, the building situation's a little odd. So we talk about that. We talk about, you know, filling out the online forms to save 15 minutes. And, and we really try to make it as efficient as possible. And then we. We use a two-way texting service to get that to 'em. We haven't been able to automate.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Yeah. Fully on that. Um, mm-hmm. But recently we got, I, we've had a few patients really commend us on our communication. Like, to your point, because uh, we have a front desk, a human front desk, [00:26:00] we have a virtual front desk that's offsite answering phones. I. Also monitoring our online scheduler. We do have online scheduling so people can, and we mm-hmm.
Dr. Kevin Christie: We, a person can even book their appointment through our EHR system, which is a button right on Google Business Profile. Um, ah, so we've been trying to do a lot of those things. I wouldn't necessarily call it, I mean, online scheduling is automated. Uh, it's not ai. I'm sure there's some AI components to it, but we've really tried to tackle that phase of it.
Dr. Kevin Christie: 'cause to your point, it's a, it's a big problem with a, with a lot of practices.
Jason Infinger: Yeah. It, it is. And I think being intentional and going back to, we spoke about foundational, so vision, mission, unique, value prop, figuring out like what is the one thing that your practice does better than everybody else? And so, for example, I have a, a, a practice to where there is communication.
Jason Infinger: They feel like, and we, we talked a lot about trust, right? Mm-hmm. How do you build trust in short windows of time? And generally it's, it's speed and communication, right? How you're actually doing that. [00:27:00] So if you're able to communicate. Clearly, simply, really quickly, you build trust right away. You get back to people, all those things, so when they come in, they're already primed to, to expect that, right?
Jason Infinger: The, the best, the best care. You're setting them up for a great, a great experience from the very beginning.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Yeah, it makes sense. And we've tried to, you know, put a lot of things in place, uh, to, to handle the communication and even on like a hospitality front, right? Mm-hmm. Where like recently, we, we have a system in place, uh, to, to contact patients if something happens.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Like we had a patient had to go to the ER because of an infection thing, so she missed her appointment and said, I, I gotta cancel my appointment. I have to go to the er, I got this infection. Had nothing to do with us. Uh, but the next day we made sure to call 'em just to see how they were doing. Right? Not, not to force feed them getting back on the schedule.
Dr. Kevin Christie: They will, but more of just like, how you doing? You know, did everything work out okay? And mm-hmm. And it, it, people are appreciating that, that other level of, of, um, communication and I think what it. [00:28:00] Kind of going back to that human plus ai, uh, if you can utilize AI or a lot of automations, it then frees up your human to do some of those nice hospitality things that may be.
Dr. Kevin Christie: AI can't, or, or maybe it will at some point. Uh, but it frees up your, your human team to really, uh, provide a, a great experience. What, what are some of your thoughts on kind of using ai, um, in, in the practice or automation, some of the mistakes people are seeing, some of the ways you're seeing AI work beautifully in chiropractic practice?
Dr. Kevin Christie: I'd love to, I'd love to go down that path a minute.
Jason Infinger: Sure, sure. I think that the biggest mistakes I'm seeing is thinking that you're gonna sign up for some kind of AI service and you're gonna implement it and boom, you're done with it. Right. Like there's not, there's like this hands-off approach with things.
Jason Infinger: Mm-hmm. That's, that's not the right mindset to have in terms of what it looks like and to set something up. Without having a plan, like it sounds like you and your team have worked on that experience of the [00:29:00] patient, right? Mm-hmm. Slowing down, right? Taking a Sunday and slowing down and, and thinking about like what's the best, you know, patient experience from beginning to end, what does that look like?
Jason Infinger: Mm-hmm. And then tagging time. To each one of those things, those little touch points of the business, tagging times to them, where are your bottlenecks? What's taking the most amount of time? You look at what's taking the most amount of time, and you can start looking and adapting services into those things.
Jason Infinger: Right? Yep. If it takes 27 minutes to onboard and the, there's paperwork to do, for example, which is a big one. All the paperwork experience, all those kind of things cannot be done before they even come in, for example. Mm-hmm. Right. Can, are there certain things that can be sent out to them? Automatically to where boom, you have a conversation, the paperwork goes out, they fill it out really seamlessly.
Jason Infinger: It's easy to do, they get it back to you, boom. They're ready for their session. Right? Versus they're coming in figuring out, no one likes to fill out paperwork. That kind of stuff. Did we fill out everything? Is everything done? Like there's a lot of ways to do it, but the biggest strategy I've seen is, is they put down the touch [00:30:00] points of the perfect client experience, our patient experience on that side, and then tag times to them and then figure out what services based on those times.
Jason Infinger: Mm-hmm. That works really well.
Dr. Kevin Christie: That makes sense. And then are you, uh, seeing any practices leverage AI in their notes? I know that's like a, a particular EHR thing. It's not something that you or I or anybody can train a person to, to do it. The EHR would've to have the capability to do it, but are you starting to see practices leverage ai?
Dr. Kevin Christie: Because I know note taking is like the bane of our existence and it's one of the biggest bottlenecks there is. But are you, are you seeing Yeah. That being leveraged now?
Jason Infinger: So, um, there, there is a, um. There is a platform, the TIP compliant, which is called Fathom. Mm-hmm. Which is actually, there's a, there's a free version of that, but there's also something called Plot to where you could have going into your session and it will record your session for you, and then it'll record it to Fathom, and then now you have a.
Jason Infinger: Notes that are seamless, it just automatically uploads to the patient record, right? So those are things that could happen really fast. So [00:31:00] as a clinician, as you're moving from room to room or doing different things on that side, whenever you wanna record the conversation and you want it to be entered into notes, you hit record.
Jason Infinger: And that's it. That helps. Yeah, it's pretty. Yeah,
Dr. Kevin Christie: I think that's gonna be a big one for us. And you know, part of how you and I found each other, 'cause I would read on my Facebook group, we've got about 5,000 members in there. Um, I kept on thinking about this, like, what would this like, you know, friction free, I.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Patient experience be like, and obviously nothing's friction free, but really how do we reduce the friction points? And then you and I had kind of hopped on a call a couple weeks ago before this to, to talk about that and, and we kind of realized like, you, you gotta have your own, um, operations as friction free as possible, which is why we're, we're talking about that, uh, today.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Mm-hmm. Then. Once you got that in place, that then frees you up to, to really have a, a phenomenal patient experience. And so I don't want to put the cart before the horse. Right? It's like sometimes building a house on, on quick stand, quick, Sam. And so if we can get this stuff down, like you and I are talking [00:32:00] about, and obviously we can't solve the world's problems in, in a 45 minute episode, but I want.
Dr. Kevin Christie: I want our audience to start thinking about these little things. Mm-hmm. Which strategic coach would call the backstage, right? Like the operation, like how do we get this really firing on all cylinders? And then once we get that going then and you know, you can do some of it concurrently, obviously, then we can really, um, optimize that patient experience.
Dr. Kevin Christie: And you mentioned earlier the flywheel effect and then obviously you and I talked about getting leads from wanting to see us to actually in the. In the door. Uh, when we spoke a few weeks ago, you mentioned the, the bow tie, uh, funnel of the, of the patient experience and what that is why that matters. Can you, can you explain that to us?
Jason Infinger: Yeah, absolutely. So the bow tie funnel, basically everybody knows a basic sales funnel, somebody coming in, how we're treating them, what that looks like all the way, and we picture it from a visual standpoint, kind of from the left to right. So the bow tie is from the left to right, is basically the sales part, right?
Jason Infinger: Yeah. People are coming in, [00:33:00] business development, that kind of good stuff. Then the center of the bow tie really is the point where they commit and they actually pay you at that point. Mm-hmm. Now, the other side of the funnel. I mean, less than 5% of practices pay attention to it, right? It's where you are building this, this brand ambassador, right?
Jason Infinger: And there are steps to this, right? So your touchpoint, so your, your patient experience. Most of the time when people map it out, they map it out from okay, the patient comes in and the patient leaves, so to speak. That's, that's just the beginning. Where, where you should be focused is, is on the other side, right?
Jason Infinger: Mm-hmm. So meaning that after they leave, what is their plan of care and. In six weeks, eight weeks, what is the follow up of that process? Are we sending them out other things to get testimonials? Are we doing other things? Are there other services, other things we can be doing along the way to now service those patients the best way possible?
Jason Infinger: So the other part of the bow tie funnel is really about having a mindset around what's next. Mm-hmm. How el, what else can I do to be servicing and helping my [00:34:00] patient? I've done X, Y, and z. What are the things that I can be doing on the other side? That's why always staying in growth mode is really important.
Jason Infinger: Yeah. So adding different services and different things to your offer on the other side. Now you have a pool of, of X patients to pull from, right? Mm-hmm. You don't have to pay for those, those leads anymore. So the other side is how do you get patients to actually refer back to you? Not only a few of 'em, but consistently.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Yeah.
Jason Infinger: That's the art of that. Yeah. I think
Dr. Kevin Christie: it's, um. It's pretty cool. And, and obviously, um, you know, you want to, you want to develop those raving fan base and that's how you can really grow practice without having to spend so much money on marketing. Like, it's definitely wise to spend money on marketing.
Dr. Kevin Christie: We all know that, uh, especially depending on if you're in growth phase and such. But if you get that flywheel going over referrals because you have a great patient experience and you know, obviously the clinical is the big one. You gotta get people better and you gotta provide, that's the core service you've gotta.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Hit a homer on there. But if you, if you do that and you, uh, have a great [00:35:00] patient experience like we talked about and everything, communication is really on point. Uh, you're, you're gonna go, um, you know, leaps and bounds among some, compared to a lot of other chiropractors. But, um, there, there's, there's kind of a third thing to this as well, and that's staying top of mind, right?
Dr. Kevin Christie: It's, uh, Dan, Ken Kennedy, who I'm sure you know. Mm-hmm. As the saying of, uh, and I've used it, I've, I've stole this saying many times, but put a, a fence around your cattle and, and really try to put content around them so they see your stuff all the time. Um, how is, uh, how are you seeing a, going, going back to the AI and kind of, uh, you know, doing a 360 here and, and going and pairing up the AI to the patient experience into the marketing.
Dr. Kevin Christie: How are you seeing AI helping chiropractors on this part of what you're talking about on the bow tie funnel?
Jason Infinger: Yeah, and there's something, um, there's something about providing wow moments or leaving room for magic, right? Mm-hmm. There needs to be a, wow, there needs to be a wow on the bow tie side. There needs to be something that you're doing, and you can even [00:36:00] automate it, that patients are going, wow, I didn't expect that.
Jason Infinger: Mm-hmm. And there needs to be something of value on that other side, right? So, and that can come in different types of forms of things, right? A new offer on something or a new product. But this also goes back to the vision of, you know. What is your vision, and then what new services are you offering if you know you're doing?
Jason Infinger: Um, we had talked before about, um, you know, uh, doing cold plunges and different things on the other side if patients are tuned into that. And especially like longevity, I'm seeing a lot of questions in, in the, in the practices around the longevity piece too. What else? This is helping now and I've had a great experience, but what are the other things that I can be doing on the other side and becoming an expert on, in that area to where you're providing all this valuable content.
Jason Infinger: That now you can put on your social media and you can send out to your patients if you have other services. Now they're primed for that and it's consistent. So you have to find at least one Wow. On the backside. You have to find something that's gonna provide a little magic. [00:37:00]
Dr. Kevin Christie: Well, and it's, it's fascinating too, 'cause it's, uh.
Dr. Kevin Christie: You're, if you're doing this right, you're gonna be able to leverage AI to, um, get your marketing out there more. Now, it's not about necessarily just using canned content, like saying, you know, asking Chappy GBT to write you a random blog, but maybe mm-hmm. Maybe you take a video you've done and you upload it into there and you get, um, a blog out of it and you get more content, or have you have it write a compelling email and, you know, things like that.
Dr. Kevin Christie: And so you're gonna use ai. To get good high quality content out there. And then you're hoping that people are gonna use AI searching for a chiropractor area and they're gonna find your human plus AI content and there's gonna be a nice little match there. And then they're gonna come into your practice and you're gonna wow 'em on a great patient experience.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Right.
Jason Infinger: Yeah, and you have to look for things. Every practice is unique in a sense of what patients are asking for, right? Yeah. You're, if you're in there and you're talking to a lot of patients and they're asking about supplements constantly, and they're asking about certain types of supplements, there's probably five of them that you get all the [00:38:00] time.
Jason Infinger: Yeah. Making videos around that, sending them out, putting 'em on social media at the same time, all that stuff is extremely valuable. And you're building this library, right? You're building this library of content.
Dr. Kevin Christie: And, uh, you know, another thing that just popped up and I actually posted in my Facebook group to get some feedback on it.
Dr. Kevin Christie: We had a picture that had, um, he had a teenage pitcher, 15 years old, had little leaguer's elbow and so we were treating him. He had a strength coach he was doing things with, and then we were, uh, graduating him to a throwing program. And so I went into, uh, I have, I use Paid Rock three and I used the deep research function on it and had him develop a throwing program for little leagues eligible for a 15-year-old, and it developed a really nice one.
Dr. Kevin Christie: It linked to a mass general throwing program and had this whole thing. I printed it out. Um, uh, printed out the throwing program, printed out what Grock did. I didn't fake it like it was my information. I talked to the patient like, Hey, look at, we, we used and I explained it. I was like, we used paid AI with the deep research function here, and it actually spits out the, the, the resources [00:39:00] that it cites it from.
Dr. Kevin Christie: And the patient thought that was really, really good. You know, and as an example of Human plus ai. And it, it saved so much of my time to, to do that. It took me like 10 minutes. And, um, that's just another example where I think we can use AI for a better patient experience. I think you need to be honest sometimes with it.
Dr. Kevin Christie: You don't want to just like, yeah, I, I made up this throwing program, but I, you know, it was, they saw Mass General. They think, oh, this must be legit. Right.
Jason Infinger: Yeah. And, and that's a great example of providing a little magic, right? Mm-hmm. The parents of, of that child will never forget that as well. He won't either.
Jason Infinger: But I mean, that, that's something that's the little magic, that's the extra step. And sometimes on the other side, um, going back to the buyback, your time, you know, process too. There's a great exercise to where they do a time audit. It. Mm-hmm. And you looking at your whole week of where you're, where you're having kind of $5 tasks and where you're at $500 tasks.
Jason Infinger: Mm-hmm. Most clinicians are spending way too much time on five and $10 tasks in their practice and just get overwhelmed. Yeah. So [00:40:00] that's where like doing research around that and somebody doing research for you around, here's what I'm looking at. They could do the research for you on that side and then you could follow up with the patient, right?
Jason Infinger: Yeah. To streamline some of that.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Yeah, I just think we can start, look at all the ways you could delegate to ai, you know? Yeah. Um, whether whatever service you decide to use Gemini and chat GBT, obviously, um mm-hmm. So, yeah. Really cool stuff. Well, Jason, this has been amazing. Um, I know you've got a, a nice little, uh, assessment that they can take in 10 minutes.
Dr. Kevin Christie: How can they find out about that and reach out to you if they wanna work with you on, on really helping to, to grow their practice?
Jason Infinger: Yeah, absolutely. So yeah, I'm happy to do it. It's a, uh, it's a health and value assessment of your practice. It kind of gives you some, some scores on all the phases of your business, um, whether it's the marketing, finances, all that kind of good stuff.
Jason Infinger: It takes about 10, 15 minutes and it actually does some valuation and enterprise value of your practice on the backside, which is extremely valuable. Um, so yeah, what I can do is, um, we can leave the link on the show [00:41:00] notes. Um, you know, everybody can reach out to me at, uh, either my LinkedIn page or ai@jasoninfinger.com.
Jason Infinger: Um, but that's, that's probably the best way. I'm happy to kind of go through, answer any questions and, and do some road mapping if that helps too with them. Happy to help your audience.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Yeah. We'll put, we'll, we'll put all that in the, in the show notes and to your point. Yeah. Um, I know you kind of specialize also with, with, you know, getting a practice that could be sold and I think, um, not enough chiropractors are looking at that and they're not looking at it in enough in advance.
Dr. Kevin Christie: And the beauty of it is, is if you're not planning on selling for 25 years, but you actually get it sellable now, it'll be a whole lot more profitable. And then Yep. Down the road, it'll, it'll be more sellable. So I think that's, that's fair. That's a good point. Yeah, chiropractor's really gotta take that seriously.
Dr. Kevin Christie: And, uh, I did some years ago, and it's, uh, it helps just, it, it helps kind of to your point too, about getting clear on your vision, right. Like it mm-hmm. If you actually do that and you get a vision around it, it, it, you know, gives you a little roadmap to, to get there. [00:42:00]
Jason Infinger: It does for sure. And there's another, not that I want to give everybody more work to do, but there's a good book called, uh, built to Sell, which helps with that very thing.
Jason Infinger: It, it, it's not something to where even if you're, if you're not gonna sell it, but getting to a place where you can make the decisions and, and all, there's a great exercise too, which is kind of a, um, work with my founders is, you know, the six month. So in six months you have to take a vacation for two weeks.
Jason Infinger: Yeah. What does that look like? What is your practice? Do things keep running without you? Does it still onboarding patients? All that kind of good stuff. And if it doesn't do that, what does it take to get there? Mm-hmm. Right. Yeah, it's a good frame. Love it. Yeah, that's a
Dr. Kevin Christie: great way of doing it. Um, I'm actually doing that similar, 'cause we're next summer, so summer of 2026, we're gonna start our first six week immersion trip.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Each summer we'll do it as a family. Love it. Um, and so I'm, I'm having, I'm having to do what you just said for two businesses, so it's, uh, yeah. Tricky. It's great. It's a great
Jason Infinger: exercise.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Yeah. Hopefully we, we, uh, we do well with it and on the back end [00:43:00] of it, we see where we need to improve. Yep. Well, Jason, this has been a, a true pleasure.
Dr. Kevin Christie: Hopefully not the last time we, we talk and I'll make sure we put all those resources in there and, uh, and thank you for, for all of your valuable wisdom today.
Jason Infinger: You got it. Thanks, doc. I appreciate it.